Divorce in the Church of Jesus Christ of LatterDay Saints Community: October 2013

Over the major part of 2012 and 2013, divorced members of the LDS faith participated in a multi-national survey. Respondents included members residing in the U.S., Europe, the British Isles, New Zealand, and Canada, the majority of input coming from Utah, California, and Idaho. This is part eleven of the survey for LDS Divorced women.

PART 11

QUESTIONS 41-43

41. Did you and your spouse get counseling while you were married?

Yes, a lot............................................................................15.6%
Yes, a little.........................................................................26.6%
No, didn't think of it............................................................6.9%
No, he refused...................................................................30.6%
No, we couldn't afford it.....................................................4.0%
Yes, through the church resources.....................................10.4%
Yes, through private means.................................................5.8%

TOO MANY LOOK BACK WITH REGRET FOR HAVING DIVORCED,
THOUGH MOST FELT IT WAS ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY

42. Looking back, do you regret getting a divorce and wish you could have worked it out instead?

Yes, I wish we hadn't done it, we should have worked it out...........13.9%
No, it was absolutely necessary........................................................86.1%

SUGGESTION: WRITE OUT A DETAILED LIST OF WHAT YOU ARE LOOKING FOR

43. What changes are you making in looking for your next relationship (if any)?

A SMALL SAMPLE OF COMMENTS:
First I need to get myself whole, and heal from the past.

"Making sure i am healed so old baggage doesnt carry over in to new relationship."
"I have made so many changes in myself, my life, my attitude and have found healing from childhood wounds. Those were absolutely necessary before moving on. And I have done a lot of emotional healing work coupled with understanding the Atonement."
"Making sure that I'm worthy of the kind of man that I want/need for me and my children. Trying to forgive. Trying to let go of the past."
"Counseling to understand my own patterns of codependency."
"Working on myself."
" Become a whole person now rather than waiting for someone to 'complete me'; take care of myself better physically, mentally and spiritually."
"I have looked at the qualities of abuse that I was drawn too..I am again divorced from an alcoholic, who fell off the wagon after marriage. I never want to end up in that situation again. I have friends who meet the guy I am dating and tell me their impressions too."
"I am working hard to shed the natural man and become who I am. I'm not as much doing it for a future spouse as I am for myself and my children and my God. I have a healthier perception of my worth, and so I know that I won't fall for someone again who will exploit my low self esteem."
"I am making sure I know who I am and have a better self esteem before I look for some one else so that my needs are met also within a relationship."
"Tell what is bothering me before I grow angry and express it the wrong way. Be more talkative Express gratitude and appreciation more often Be more open to criticism."
"Understanding myself. Not compromising. Being real. Trust instincts. Love self."
"More confidence! Following The Lord more."
"I'm working on my self esteem so I won't settle next time."
"Have myself in a confident, loving place."
"I am working on not being critical and judgmental, or trying to change a potential partner. If I don't like somethings about them while dating I need to learn to live with it or move on. Also, any future spouse must have the similar life goals and expectations."
"It has taken me 24 years to let go and going to sit in the Temple grounds has made me think that now I should do something for me and start looking again for a new partner."
"Trying to set boundaries that are clear with myself..Dropping coy and flirtiness for flirtiness sake and trying to be ttrue to myself as well as kind."
"I tried to see what my contributions were to the breakup and how to not bring those into a second marriage."
"I'm taking a hard look at myself. I loved the info in How to Avoid Falling In Love With a Jerk by John Van Epp. It was recommended by my counselor and has completely changed how I view relationships & how to see the 'red flags.'"
"Focusing on healing myself and understanding my own strengths and weaknesses. I would want to receive counseling from both bishops and I would want to know why his prior marriage dissolved. I would do a background check and talk with a variety of people who know him. I would also seek couples therapy before marriage."
"I have changed the parts of me that weren't great. I may not have been the cause of the divorce, but I needed to work on my self esteem, and other things."
"Trying to continue living the gospel to the best of my ability."
"I pray that I will only be attracted to worthy men and that I, myself, will be worthy of them."
"Not blaming myself for anything other than my own behavior. I can only control myself and my own actions. I'm trying to learn to trust again."
"Taking my time, changing the way I look at things and think about marriage, and staying close to the Spirit."
"Being absolutely sin-free and able to get confirmation from HG."
"Just trying to understand myself, learn better self-management, learn the Gospel of Jesus Christ and of Him more deeply as I can, get out of debt slowly but surely, learn what friendship is and learn to be a good friend and so try to seek out those who can be safe, good friends... keep a sense of humor. be a thankful person, kind, caring, understanding, honest and loyal... and seek those qualities in others... keep to the boundaries I have learned I need, and not let anyone control me or threaten me... let go of unhealthy people and ideas - even about romance, etc., limit what media I read/watch/listen to - to wholesome, uplifting, hopeful themes, when possible... to keep positive and to help stay motivated to keep working and getting through."
"Realizing I have value and worth and they were wrong in judging me."
" Doing my best to get stronger emotionally."
"I've gotten lots of therapy, worked through the abuse issues."
"I'm not sure if I want another relationship. This was so painful and my trust in men is extremely low. It has been a long recovery for me. I have been taught through the spirit, the things about myself that I can do to change. I'm trying not to dwell on past mistakes, but learning to not make them again is the real lesson."
"I am working to be the kind of person I want to attract. I deserve happiness."
" I want to be authentic in how I live and how I serve. I'm trying to be healthier and develop my interests and talents."
"I am making these changes in myself: I am learning more about myself and accepting who I am even with my faults. I am learning about the atonement. I am not worthless. I have great worth! I am finding and using my voice more and being assertive about what I need and want. I am less co-dependent and finding that I am a real person, not just an extension of someone else. I am treating myself better. I stopped eating sugar, started to run a little again, and started to read the scriptures again. I am dejunking not only my house, but my mind as well! I am throwing out all of the junk that does not serve me. I am reaching out to make new friendships and having more fun too. I will be signing up for a swing dance class soon. I am scared, but it is exciting too. It feels like I have been living in a cave for so long, and now I am just starting to come out and into the sun again. The numbness is starting to wear off and I am starting to love myself and actually live."
" I need to learn to love myself first."
"After many years of emotional and verbal abuse and chronic lying, it takes me a while to build myself back up to where I used to be. I also have to reconstruct my life upon the truth and sift through all of the lies I have been believing. I find out more everyday, realizing how bad I had it. I feel like I have been let out of prison. Many are angry with me for breaking it up, but I knew that God finally granted me permission, and His opinion is the one that matters. I am standing up for myself now. No more door mat life for me. No more pretending to be the 'perfect Mormon family.' I have PTSD, and many health issues due to the constant stress, but I am putting myself first for a change, and am getting well."

Take it slow.

"Go slow and get spiritual confirmation."
"Take time to really get to know him before we move the relationship too fast."
"Next time will take things very slow, not get involved in a serious relationship too quickly, will be friends with many singles first, try dating a few different people, don't settle."
"I'm not quite ready for the next relationship yet...although I wish I was. I know I will be looking for some VERY different qualities this time around, and I will be a LOT more observant as to how he interacts with others and what kind of relationship he has with family members, friends, etc. I was naive to a lot before...not any more!"
"I will take plenty of time and get to know him better before marriage, and try to be sure that we want the same things out of life."
"Slow relationship so that I knew my future spouse well."
"Just taking my time, trying to be patient and trust Heavenly Father. "
"really taking my time to get to know me and then when ready for a serious relationship taking the time to really get to know him....people lie....and most that lie arent even honest with themselves."
"Right after a break up we are looking for someone to rescue us. We are very vulnerable, not a good time for choosing a mate. I am taking it slow and enjoying the single's scene, making friends, having fun. I am moving forward very cautiously. I don't want to go through THAT ever again!"

Make sure I know everything about him, past, present, future

"Knowing a lot about the person I marry - take my time and be in lots of different life situations with them. knowing their past better."
"Make sure i realy know the person."
"I'm looking at his actions more than hearing his words."
"My courtship will be longer (dating for almost a year before becoming engaged). This gives the opportunity for fine tuning some things, and avoiding some big upsets, before we're married."
""I would go into a relationship with my eyes wide open, remember what is important, love of the gospel, family, kindness, trust, integrity."
"Make sure that everyone is on the same page."
"Working as hard as I can to keep close and connected."
"While I was dating the guy I am now married to, I got onto his computer while he was out of the room to check out where he had been. I could see no sign of porn or anything else inappropriate. I asked questions of my friends about his behavior when I was not there with him, like at parties somewhere else. I met some of his family, and his kids to see what that relationship was like. We talked a lot in person, through texting, emails, and learned more and more what we had in common, and the few things we differed on. We spent a lot of time together and I saw him in every circumstance. He was always a gentleman (even when I wasn't around). He never spoke ill of anyone, and adores his parents and brothers. He has many friends, and takes care of everyone in his circle of influence. I did my homework, and when I couldn't live without him any longer, I married him! I never knew I could be so happy."

He will have to be genuine in the church, temple worthy, church attending....

"They have to be living the gospel fully now. temple attending and love of family."
"I have trust issues and am looking at how strong they are Church-wise."
"Try this time not to marry outside the church."
"He must not just hold a temple recommend, but hold it honestly."
"Temple recommend does not mean they are worthy."
"Realize I'm worthy of someone with the same spiritual and physical goals as myself."
"I would never marry outside of the church. Hopefully the temple."
"Temple Marriage."
"Seeking an active member."
"Going to the temple regularly, reading scriptures every night with my fiancé, talking about how to serve others and ask those questions while dating instead of finding out afterwards."
"I thought I'd married a worthy Priesthood holder the first time."
"I will marry in the temple, or not at all."
"I don't know, how does one see past fake Priesthood holders?"
"That he held a Temple Recomend and loved the Lord and was in good standing..."
"I want someone as committed to the Gospel As I am. More committed to his covenants than to himself."
"I DID ENVY SOME OF THE WOMEN IN THE WARD BECAUSE THEY LOVED THEM ENOUGH TO MARRY THEM IN THE TEMPLE, WHICH I WANT NEXT TIME."
"My first husband was cheating on me for 30 plus years, all the while he was serving in church callings (such as Bishop, stake presidency, seminary teacher......). I want someone who is genuine. I want someone who loves the Lord like I do, and not for show."

SEEKING A LIFE PARTNER, AN IMPORTANT DISCOVERY PERIOD

He will need to have certain qualities

"Someone emotionally healthy."
"I am more aware of the fact that because someone served a mission doesn't make them a good person. I pay attention to the details of the persons activities."
"Effective communication, and learn what their primary love language is so we can start the right way."
"Someone who is mentally stable, and treats me with respect."
"Trustworthy."
"Trust and respect."
"He has to place others well-fair above his own."
"Someone who has personal integrity, character and conviction."
"Someone who is more playful, who will do things with me, who cares about me."
"I'm looking for someone that I truly love instead of settling."
"Being way too careful....references, background check - seriously.....after I meet them and give them a chance of course."
"It scares me to death. I haven't found anyone yet that can answer these three questions: 1. Do you righteously have a temple recommend? 2. Do you have a positive relationship with you children? 3. Do yo have a job? I don't have to ask the questions, time tells. I guess I will wait before I make a commitment. What I thought I married the first time changed after we were married. So I guess I am looking for consistency."
"The primary thing I am treated with respect and love; if I ever get involved again, i want it to be someone I truly can admire. Also, my ex was inactive, the church meant nothing to him. I want someone who has a testimony."
"Some one whom I can respect and honor their priesthood and some one who will respect me."
"He has to be a man of god, no drinking, no smoking, no drugs, church every week if he can due to work."
"Looking... not for who I can live WITH.. but who I can't live without!"
"More communication. Truly equal in decisions."
"Good father."
"I am looking for someone who's not perfect, but willing to admit their weaknesses and take responsibility for them. I want someone who's honest, vulnerable, respectful, and kind in every setting. I want someone who is willing to speak my love languages of service & quality time. I want someone who is willing to learn & grow together. And someone who will go to counseling even before we're married."
"AN honest man. Who is trully converted."
"Someone who wants to be married to me."
"TRUE COMMITTMENT TO THE CHURCH, SELFLESS NATURE, HONEST WITH ME."
"I MUST have attraction this time, no settling. I must be madly in love with him, can't live without him, want to be with him always, love to talk together, snuggle, and it would be really nice if he had some sensitivity to my needs. It comes naturally with most women to anticipate men's needs, but it would be nice to have a guy looking out for me too."
"I need someone who is more mellow."
"I'm looking for complete honesty and my best friend, but not hopeful he's out there."
"Good with my kids, steady job, good education, passion for life, motivation to make it through the hard times."
"That we both look out after each other. Work together. Service to each other isn't enough. You have to be friends, work together and actually enjoy being together."
"Making sure that he is mentally stable."
"I hope I'm looking for more eternally important qualities, characteristics in a potential partner."
"Mutual accountability. Healthy respect and kindness. Personally responsible. Live in integrity."
"Cherish the other person above all others and treat each other with love and respect."
"I want someone who is real, fun, intelligent, secure in who he is, who knows how to love and serve."

He will NOT have certain qualities

"He can't be involved with porn."
"Someone who is not self-absorbed, egotistical, selfish...."
"I will not marry someone who has bipolar disorder or any other personality disorder again."
"I avoid men with emotional problems. I have no interest in 'rescuing' anyone."
"I WILL LOOK FOR SIGNS OF HIS BEING A PERVERT."
"To not marry a dictator, to marry a man who respects me more and does not lie, does not cheat."
"Not currently looking...happy with my life, Grandkids and work..too many out there are involved in porn, gambling , drinking or premarital sex....i will wait for the millennium...one of the lost tribes or Teancum!"
"Not marrying a manipulative, controlling man who controls in the name of God and his "priesthood". I want to add that I am not anti-mormon. I am anti men who believe that living this particular religion gives them excess freedoms of prideful opinion and righteous indignation."
"THERE ARE A LOT OF MEN THAT THINK THAT JUST BECAUSE THEY HOLD THE PRIESTHOOD, THAT THEIR OPINION IS THE ONLY ONE THAT MATTERS IN A MARRIAGE. & WHEN ARE PREACHED OVER THE PULPIT THEY DON'T APPLY TO THEM, THEY ARE ABOVE THE LAW OF THE REST OF US."
"I would be passing a kidney stone while having pneumonia and my husband would still leave me with the kids and go to work, and expect to have dinner waiting for him when he came home. I want a husband who knows how to take care of me when needed."

I will recognize the red flags this time

WATCH OUT FOR THE RED FLAGS

"Paid more attention to red flags."
"I know the signs of abuse now, I won't fall for it again."
"Now I can spot a control freak, sociopath a mile away."
"I am all-too-ready to bail out on a relationship when I see red flags. That's good in a way, but I don't want it to be an obstacle in moving forward. At my age, about the only real candidate for me will be a widower. The divorced men in my age bracket, who are also church members, are generally not good candidates in any way. The men I meet who are not in the church are much better candidates, but back away when I draw the line about chastity before marriage. Fun life, here."
"On my first date with my ex, my instincts told me to run. I will follow those instincts next time and not let my intellect talk me out of it. He appeared to be such a good returned missionary. He was a con-artist of tall proportions."

Get involved in church Single's activities

"I have LDS singles friends groups in my age range on faceebook and can learn about all kinds of men and women this way wiothout being too close... I do not date now... and have not... but am learning slowly to get-to-know others and interact slow but sure... Learning to trust myself and love myself and care for myself is also ongoing but important. Seeking out only those that have LDs standards and a testimony and love for Christ is paramount... like mindedness in faith and ideas and feelings about things in this life and the life to come is very important. How they follow through with these things in their life and also in my life - to see if that could work together is important too... so what they say and what they do are more in harmony - with room for understanding - as I would want as well.."
" It is very difficult for the 45+ crowd. I find that many in that group have rebounded and failed in another marriage. It is increasingly difficult for them to trust or even extend themselves. At this point, I think I would be an excellent marriage partner, but meeting others, or even having men ask, is very difficult. I've tried singles sites, I have a facebook group with close to 300 members (2/3 women), I've gone to firesides and find them a terrible way to develop friendships, there are not a lot of avenues left. But I will keep open, pray for it daily, and keep trying new things."
"The Single's Ward and activities saved me. I made friends there and we got together often. I threw many parties at my place (from Academy Awards to General Conference to pot luck) and had built up a great support group. We struggled together and stuck together through break ups with boyfriends, to some getting married, and are healing together. I could not have had this kind of support in a family ward. The women all thought that I wanted their husbands and shunned me."
"The Single's arena in the church has many great activities and opportunities for worship together, and that added support that singles need. I highly recommend joining up with others who are in the same boat. There is a camaraderie being with those who know what it is like to have failed marriages, abusive/cheating spouses, who are struggling to make ends meet, sometimes while raising kids. No one else gets it. It's the only place you will find understanding."

Success stories

"I remarried twenty-one years ago to a widower who is emotionally healthy and I have been very happy in the relationship even though we have had major problems with the children of our combined family, that did not drive a wedge between us."

"I married a man much better than I am. A smart move on my part, and he makes me very happy."

"My forever husband is the complete opposite of the type of men I had dated in the past. I had always picked controlling, abusive men. My husband is SO GOOD to me. In 7.5 years of being married, he has never said an unkind criticism towards me. We have children now, and he has seen me through the worst and is still in love with me! Thank you, Heavenly Father, for encouraging that dirtbag ex of mine to leave me!!!! I would have held on to that marriage tooth and nail, and boy, did I try! So glad there were other forces watching out for me and my sealed, eternal family!! Thank you for this survey; it was very therapeutic to reflect and see how far I've come, and to remember how blessed I feel!!!"

"I have been remarried again for almost 18 yrs. He is a wonderful, secure man who has a deep testimony of the lord and loves me very much and is completely commited to our relationship. I have been very blessed!"

"I am one of the most happily married people that I know."

"I made sure I married a mentally stable man that made me a better person. Someone I hated to be away from, and someone that I could belly laugh with, and have great conversations with."

"I FOUND A GREAT HUSBAND WHO IS PERFECT FOR ME AND BRINGS OUT THE BEST IN ME INSTEAD OF MAKING ME MISERABLE EVERY MOMENT OF MY LIFE."

"I did find a wonderful man, to my utter astonishment, he passed all of my tests, we married over a year ago, and I have never been so happy in my whole life. I was told that there were good guys out there and did not believe it. I thought I'd live my life alone. Although, being single has not been NEARLY as lonely as being in a marriage with a selfish, unloving, manipulative, cheating man. Now, as miserable as I was, I am on the opposite side of the spectrum in happiness and love."

A CHANCE AT TRUE AND EVERLASTING LOVE

Other:

"Make sure to hug him everyday and tell him that I love him."
"Listen to the holy ghost. Realize that we each are who we are and will not be changing just to keep a relationship going."
"I am currently not ready to date but am working on making new friends and doing things as a single person--not just as a mom. Some things that I am looking at are: Pay attention to those promptings and signs that what they say doesn't match up to what they do."
"My ex husband was the bishop so I'm looking for ?"
"Not looking for "next relationship" yet waiting for my kids to leave home. It's too late in the game for me to bring a man to the house. I don't feel that it's fair to them."
"Though I do not feel the divorce was my fault, I still learned a great deal from it, and much more since joining the church, I am in a much better place to choose a spouse now, and a much better place to make it work."
"I waited to get divorced until my kids were all grown. It took a toll on my self-esteem and health. I don't know if I recommend it, I almost didn't survive. But my kids are firm in the gospel and are very emotionally healthy. But they did not support me in the split, though I am still loving them and they are coming around. I am looking for someone who has always been a good father, and who will be a good father-in-law to my children, and a good grandfather to my grandchildren. It is a family deal after all. He'd better love children this time."
"Not very hopeful."
"I wish I had a crystal ball to look into each man and see who he really is.....I'm tired of the fake churchy men who come to the Single's Ward just to find a wife. Most men just stop coming to church after a divorce, which tells me that they wouldn't go without a woman kicking him out the door. I want a guy who gets himself there for the right reasons."
"It's hard to have a relationship. When you work, and have your kids 24/7, it's hard to find time to date. I've done some Internet dating."
"Making sure my kids and I are ok and ready and that I have the Lord's permission to proceed."
"I'm really cautious of dating. My eyes are more open. My kids come first."
"I only trust God...not my choice in men."
"I don't know if I trust my taste in men, or won't be fooled again."
"Told him if he thought of leaving the church to be honest with me & not hide it until it's too late."
"I have had to move and completely start over somewhere new. I am making new friends to replace the ones I lost. I stay away from family wards, I have never been treated so badly. Even though he was the cheater. I have the 'D word' on my forehead and am not accepted anymore."
"To be honest, I don't date - don't receive interest. From the time of his infidelity/leaving/filing for divorce to the divorce being final was only five months. It all happened rather quickly. There wasn't truly an opportunity for working anything out, or really even knowing he wasn't happy in the marriage."
"It depends on who I meet. If I meet someone compatible, I may not need to change anything. If I meet someone who enjoys different things than I, I would try to enjoy those things too."
"I JUST DON'T FEEL HOPEFUL OF EVER BEING IN A HEALTHY RELATIONSHIP."
"Reveiw my list on what is important to me and make sure he really loves my core being. Make a pre-marriage agreement and/ or counceling to include how you see finances spent, where you would like to live together.How you will blend the families. What the expectations are."
" The answer is no--I did not do everything I could to save the marriage. I could have saved the marriage the same way I did for years, being numb and living a joyless, empty life. I could have saved my marriage, but I would have lost myself forever. I had to choose, and I finally made the right choice."
"Advice for internet daters, talk for a long time before meeting, then only meet at a public place. The temple is a good place to start, find out if he has a current recommend. Stay away from his or your place. If he pushes to find a more intimate setting, don't fall for it. Too many of these guys want to get you in bed. Trust me on this!"

44. Do you feel like you did everything you could to save the marriage?

YES...........................................................................................89.8%
NO.............................................................................................10.2%

45. Overall, which social group in your life was the most helpful during/after your divorce?

(ranking from 1-very helpful, to 6-not very helpful)

____________1 extremely 2 very 3 somewhat 4 occasionally 5 seldom 6 never
Ward leadership.......13.0%........15.2%.........18.5%.............22.8%............9.8%.......20.7%
Ward membership.....5.4%.........15.2%.........28.3%............23.9%............18.5%.......8.7%
Friends......................28.3%........31.5%.......13.0%..............6.5%...............8.7%.......12.0%
Family.......................51.1%.......25.0%........12.0%..............5.4%..............5.4%..........1.1%
Home Teachers..........0.0%..........5.4%.........10.9%.............22.8%............34.8%......26.1%
Visiting Teachers.......2.2%..........7.6%.........17.4%.............18.5%............27.2%......27.2%

46. What state/country did you live in during the divorce?

Utah, California, Idaho, Washington, Colorado, New York, Texas, North Carolina, Ireland, Ohio, Oregon, Oklahoma, Florida, Illinois, Pennsylvania, Kentucky, England, New Zealand, Canada, Scotland, Europe.

CONTRIBUTORS FROM ALL OVER THE WORLD

THE END

THANKS TO ALL WHO CONTRIBUTED TO THE SUCCESS OF THIS SURVEY. YOUR VOICE HAS BEEN HEARD.

Wednesday, October 23, 2013

WHY DO I CARE?

SURVEY RESULTS FOR LDS DIVORCED WOMEN, part 11